UPDATE: 15.25am GMT 30 May – RESOLVED
Paypal have acknowledged the double billing issue!
Please see here and here.
If YOU are a merchant whose customers have been affected by double billing, Paypal have confirmed that you can EITHER refund one of the two transactions by yourself OR contact their merchant support.
Sincere thanks to Karen and Danny in Paypal for their help, for working together to resolve our problems and for keeping us informed along the way.
While we have received great service from two individuals at Paypal within the last 12 hours, this does not excuse the lack of communication or assistance that we were forced to endure in the previous two weeks. We remain distinctly dissatisfied with the way Paypal have handled this situation.
As far as we can see, ALL the issues we previously reported are now RESOLVED.
UPDATE: 13.45am GMT 30 May
We have just emailed all the requested information to our contact in the Paypal Office of Executive Escalations who has promised to further investigate our case.
It appears that Paypal really ARE capable of providing good support – it’s just a shame that it took so long (and a blog post?) for it to happen.
UPDATE: 13.05am GMT 30 May
The excellent chap now looking after our case in “PayPal Merchant Technical Support” has just updated us again:
I’m working with our management team to setup a procedure for all the PayPal merchant affected by this issue.
We will also post shortly on our forum an acknowledgement of this additional issue with subscriptions, where you can redirect your customers in case they need a clarification.
I’ll keep you posted.
While it has taken weeks for this to happen Paypal ARE now communicating and we hope that the remaining unresolved issues will shortly be resolved for all of us.
UPDATE: 12.55am GMT 30 May
We are delighted to advise that we have spoken to a very helpful person in the Paypal Office of Executive Escalations. She apologised on behalf of Paypal, is fully investigating our case at present and has noted all our points in relation to the lack of communication and assistance. We will keep you updated.
UPDATE: 12.05am GMT 30 May
We have received a further email from “PayPal Merchant Technical Support”.
After reviewing those transactions I fully agree with the description of the issue you gave me.
Folks – we hope this means that the double billing issues will be resolved shortly.
UPDATE: 11.50am GMT 30 May
We have now received a voicemail from the Paypal Office of Executive Escalations. They would like to speak to us about the ongoing subscription problems and double billing issues. They are due to call us back later today.
UPDATE: 11.20am GMT 30 May
We have received a further email from “PayPal Merchant Technical Support”. They have informed us that the missing subscription issue has been resolved as we established in our update at the end of this post at 11:20pm GMT yesterday.
They have also confirmed that they are investigating the double billing issue. We are very relieved to finally KNOW that Paypal are actively investigating and addressing our concerns.
We will update again as we hear more.
UPDATE: 7.40am GMT 30 May
We have received an email from “PayPal Merchant Technical Support”
Thank you for contacting PayPal Merchant Technical Support.
I will research this matter further and update you with more information as it becomes available. If you have any additional information or updates to your issue, please use the instructions in this email to update your ticket.
Thank you for your patience.
Although the double billing issue remains, in light of many of the other issues being resolved we are hopeful that this problem will be fixed shortly.
Many thanks to all of you for your support. Particular thanks to our customers who have been directly affected by these problems for their patience and understanding.
We would like to emphasise that if the problems had been “just” affecting StatCounter we could have lived with that (e.g. if payment to our bank account was delayed) but since these problems have impacted on our members also, Paypal’s lack of action is simply unacceptable.
We are not happy that these issues had to brought into the public domain like this, however, Paypal’s lack of communication and assistance left us with no other option.
It may be a coincidence, but on the day that we posted this blog, nearly all of the highlighted issues were reported as “resolved”, 14 days after all of the problems arose.
We would still welcome an official response from Paypal in relation to these these problems.
Hi folks,
The Issue
We are having ongoing, critical problems with Paypal.
In view of the complete lack of assistance from Paypal in this regard, we have decided that we have no option but to inform you, our members, about the facts of the situation. This will allow you to make an informed decision about whether to use (or whether to continue to use) Paypal.
Please note that these problems may arise not only in relation to payments made to StatCounter but in relation to ANY Paypal payments that you make. We hope that this post will equip you with the information necessary to make sure that YOU do not become another victim of this ongoing Paypal saga.
The Problems
On 15 May Paypal performed a site update – this is confirmed by Paypal here.
After this date numerous problems were reported across the globe:
- The Paypal Handling Cart feature completely broke down – see update below
- Cross border payments could not be made as the drop down country list did not work – see update below
- Customers have been flooded with hundreds of duplicate subscription emails from Paypal – see update below
- Payments from Paypal are no longer associated with the relevant subscriptions – see update below
- Some customers have been and are being DOUBLE BILLED by Paypal
- Merchants have not been receiving instant payment notifications or failure notifications
- Merchants/customers are unable to cancel subscriptions – see update below
The main problem that we have with Paypal is NOT the list of issues above – we all know that errors happen – we are absolutely furious at the complete lack of acknowledgement or assistance from Paypal in relation to these matters.
At StatCounter we have tried phoning, emailing, posting on the Paypal forums… Many of our contacts are ignored, but even when we do get an answer all we are told is that “Upon review of your account, unfortunately we do not have a time frame for a resolution to your issue we are currently actively investigating your issue with subscriptions.” You can see our posts in the Paypal forums here and here.
It appears that all of these problems are the result of the update made by Paypal on 15 May. Typically, any software upgrades can be “rolled back” if they are found to be flawed. Paypal’s inability (unwillingness?) to do this does not bode well.
What does this mean for me as a StatCounter Paypal Subscriber?
Unfortunately, we will be unable to issue invoices to many of our customers who pay us via Paypal until such time as the above issues are resolved. This is because the “payment file” provided by Paypal and from which invoices are generated is incomplete.
There is also a danger that you may be “double billed”. Please make sure to check your Paypal account to see if this happens. Although we would be delighted to sort out any double billing for you, in the current climate of confusion we are unsure whether WE are actually receiving the erroneously charged amounts. This means that WE are not currently able to refund any of these overpayments to you. We strongly believe that since this is a Paypal error, Paypal should rectify the situation – and leave us to focus again on our members rather than cleaning up a mess of Paypal’s making. Please do report any double billing to us and we will take action to report each case directly to Paypal.
Other StatCounter Upgrade Options
Please note that you can also make subscription payments to StatCounter using your credit card directly, by cheque or by electonic transfer to our bank.
Conclusion
Folks – we sincerely regret any problems you are experiencing and assure you that we are doing our best to get all of these issues resolved for you. We strive to offer a high level of customer service and pride ourselves on being responsive to the needs and suggestions of our members. To have our hands “tied” in this way as a result of Paypal’s inaction is frustrating to say the least.
These problems with Paypal have already cost us thousands of dollars. We continue to expend large amounts of time and resources on these issues – resources which we would much prefer to concentrate on improving the service we provide to you. We would be very grateful for your patience at this time as we wait for Paypal to resolve these issues.
We would also ask you to be patient with any of our fellow internet merchants experiencing difficulties with Paypal at this time.
Please post any comments or questions below.
Notes:
- This post is not intended to alarm, instead it is intended to inform.
- We at StatCounter do not take any pleasure in having to report these issues to you, rather we feel at this point that we have no option but to do so.
- While we hope that this post will generate media attention which may force Paypal to finally act and respond to the various problems outlined above, it is not the intention of the post to generate publicity for StatCounter.
- As we like to try to accomodate the needs of our members Paypal is still currently available as a payment option on StatCounter for new upgraded account subscribers. This position is currently under review and opinions from our members in this regard are being sought here.
- Paypal, of course, have a right of reply to this post and should they wish to contact us, we would be happy to post their response here.
Other Links:
www.channelregister.co.uk
tech.blorge.com
www.finextra.com
Paypal Forums 1
Paypal Forums 2
Paypal Forums 3
Update 2pm GMT 29 May: This post by Paypal indicates that the following issues have been resolved:
1) For subscription signups, when trying to enter billing information users
are not be able to change the country on the billing page.
2) For merchants using “handling_cart” parameter with PayPal Shopping
Cart buttons handling amount is not charged.
To the best of our knowledge the other issues remain and do not yet appear to have been acknowledged by Paypal.
Update 9pm GMT 29 May: A post by a Paypal staff member here indicates that these issues (some of which we weren’t even aware of) have been resolved:
1. Cannot change ‘country’ for subscriptions.
2. Free trials not being charged once trial period is over.
3. Subscriptions with free trials not being shown in history log.
4. Can’t cancel an active subscription.
5. Multiple emails being recieved (sic) for subscription payments.
No mention appears to have been made of these issues:
# Payments from Paypal are no longer associated with the relevant subscriptions
# Some customers have been and are being DOUBLE BILLED by Paypal
# Merchants have not been receiving instant payment notifications or failure notifications
The double billing remains the major issue of concern to us.
Update 11:20pm GMT 29 May:
Although we have still not received any official communications from Paypal, we can confirm from our own experience that payments from Paypal ARE now again being associated with the relevant subscriptions. For StatCounter members with Paypal upgrades this will mean that we can now issue you with your outstanding invoices.
We have confirmed in our account that the double billing issue persists:
# Some customers have been and are being DOUBLE BILLED by Paypal
As far as we are aware, the following issue also remains:
# Merchants have not been receiving instant payment notifications or failure notifications
I had problems too…
3 months ago I’ve purchased something online and Paypal took the money 2 times on my account. Asked the seller to refund one of the payments, he told me he would but never did
Contacted Paypal they said it’s a problem between the seller and me, and that they can’t do anything. I was angry since I never gave any authorization for them to take money 2 times.
Paypal don’t answer anymore about this issue. They’ve deleted the issue I cannot track it anymore under my paypal account. I sit on my $300 they are lost
Since then I don’t use anymore paypal (I was using it as a merchant with around $3000 in sales per months) so they lost fees
ciao
Google displays “horror stories” at the following URL: http://www.aboutpaypal.org/
They are all tring to make easy money! They don’t care about you or the product they are offering as long as they have huge profits! This is the american style and their super ability to foul you through thier advertisements!
I dont care as PayPal is not supporting PAKISTAN…
Is there a good alternative for Paypal for transactions all over the world?
The 4% fee is anoying me a long time already.
Hi all,
Paypal sucks.
They also send wrong verification codes when you try to add a new credit card. I don’t use paypal anymore.
I never used it, but still, thanks!
The rare occasions I paid by way of Internet I split my creditcard# in two random pieces and spent two mails on it – a bit verbose, I admit, but safe.
For domestic payments I use the facilities of my private bank (it’s called Ideal) or just the regular Internet banking, in which case they charge you for payments outside Europe. Banks …
*jk
i haven’t used paypal personally or professionally for over 3 years. not one good thing to say about them at any level.
Why don ‘t you use 2CO ? (they also accept paypal payments)
This is just typical of an arogant compny like PayPal. I onluy ever hear good things about Stat Counter, so Im sure your customer base would remain loyal if you decided to change providers…
Dump PayPal and find someone else… (please)
hi
Thanks for mailing me
Ah, folks — www.screw-paypal.com
That’s all there is to it. I’m not here to plug this guy’s site but this site is the MONSTER of them all, the king of all “go to hell” paypal sites.
check it out because it’s got a lot of information on what PayPal really is and what you can do about it. it’s not just about whining, they actually show you how you can get your account fixed.
thanks guys!
HURRY UP!
CUT ALL TIES with PAYPAL!
They are part of eBay, and eBay by now is considered a “criminal organisation” by the European authorities! It is only a matter of time until this entire house of cards will collapse !
Just recently eBay Europe have moved their headquarter from (the small) Switzerland to the even smaller Liechtenstein because the chief judge against white collar crime was about to start an investigation!
eBay Europe is on the run. Paypal is their “partner in crime” and there are countless victims of their business proceedings as it is.
DONT BECOME ONE OF THEM! BACK OUT as fast as you can!
Read more at www.ebay-home4crooks.com
The have my money, I cannot access my paypal account to retrieve or send the money to anyone else, all because I reached a ‘limit’ of expenditure and cannot lift the limit due to not having a bank account assigned to the PP account. How bloody ridiculous is that!?!
Paypal is a mafia setup that needs to be exposed. I have over $500 stuck in their pockets and have no means of retrieving it. They are the most untrustworthy company on the internet ever. We must do a major online campaign of exposure and exploitation of the companies carefless-ness in order to make them change their ways.
Google checkout <<<< lets all move.
I’ve had my share of problems with paypal too. I am based in India, and when I requested them for assistance for a missing cheque, they responded only after multiple emails and coaxing. When they did respond their answer was not helpful, and did not match their online DECLARED policy.
When i send them repeated emails, they started forwarding me standard replies which asked me to call the US assistance number. When I called the US assistance number I was kept going in circles by automated response and never could reach a real live person.
I THINK PAYPAL IS A CHEAT. I HAVE VOWED NEVER TO USE PAYPAL AGAIN.
Please avoid using Paypal. They’re a fraud.
Thanks
Shruti Gupta
paypal is an ebay company and it sucks……
PAYPAL ADMIN SUPPORT SUCKS….MAJORLY SUCKS. THEY COULD GIVE ONE FUCKING IDOTA SHIT ABOUT YOU AND ME THEIR CUSTOMERS. PASS THE BUCK…PASS THE BUCK…..SO I SAY TO ALL OF U. STOP USING PAYPAL…..FIND ANOTHER WAY DUDES. ITS EASY. LATER.